How good do you think you are?

Discussion in 'Aquatic Health/Diseases' started by Professor_fish, Nov 18, 2016.

  1. Professor_fish

    Professor_fish German blue ram Fish guru

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    How good do you think you are at recognizing fish disease?

    At first it looks like a stupid question, but stop and think for a minuet and ask yourself this..... How confident are you, that you could identify most 'common' disease?

    The obvious answer for most experienced keepers would be 'highly confident', and on the face of it this might seem reasonable.

    But a few things have made me stop and think recently, for example lets take the following description of disease, such as is likely to get posted asking for help....

    HELP ME..my fish is dying, it has ragged fins and spots of broken vein like things in its fins. it looks like it is bleeding internally because it has red patches down its side.

    The fish looks alot like this one i found on google.
    koi-ulcer.jpg

    So how confident are you that you could diagnose this correctly?

    15 years ago i would have given an answer to this picture and been 99% sure i was right, but not so much today. I am sure i could get close and maybe name the possible family of pathogen responsible, i could guess three likely species responsible for it but only be 25% i had it right!

    One way or another we get asked alot to identify disease and i have seen alot of it, but the last 10-15 years things have changed a bit, there seems to be an alarming increase in disease, of more concern is the change in organisms we see.

    For example we were asked about a fish with similar signs to the fish above recently, at first i gave a swift answer but decided to run some tests to make sure. The reason I ran the genetic tests was simply because the fish was from a farm, so it kind of mattered.

    The results surprised me, i was completely wrong, the results came back as belonging to a group of bacteria we rarely if ever see problems from, also the farm had used a medication that should have wiped the bacteria out but didnt.

    It also worried me that this looked so similar to things we see alot of, it made me wonder how many keepers get it wrong? Considering the average keeper cant run a pcr test or own so much as a microscope, most cant do a simple gram stain test. So most keepers are stuck with the simple 'eye test (what does it look like)', this is the main problem, how do you identify something that was previously only caused by X organism, but now seems to be mimicked by A,B,C organisms??

    Anyway i did a journal search and it turns out this is becoming a much bigger problem, a recent article in a journal mentions something similar.
    http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/jfd.12457/full

    food for thought...........
     
  2. CarpCharacin

    CarpCharacin Cyprinus carpio Administrator Fish mentor

    That is a good post! Thanks @Professor_fish. I would guess that the fish in the picture has some type of sepsis.
     
  3. CarpCharacin

    CarpCharacin Cyprinus carpio Administrator Fish mentor

  4. Professor_fish

    Professor_fish German blue ram Fish guru

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    yes but can you read the abstract? if not i will post the abstract, it says enough to make the point, the full article is interesting but not needed to understand the post. Shout if you can see the abstract, i cant test the link as i am taken to the full article.
     
  5. CarpCharacin

    CarpCharacin Cyprinus carpio Administrator Fish mentor

    I can see the abstract.
     
  6. Professor_fish

    Professor_fish German blue ram Fish guru

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    Thats ok then. The reason it matters is because in the pic i posted it could be bacterial from 4 different groups, the problem is 3 are gram negatives and one is gram positive. What might work for 2 of the bacterial groups wont work for the other two and for one group would actually make things worse.

    This presents serious issues for treating fish disease especially on larger farm scales.
     

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